Author Topic: 4MR357P help with info  (Read 524 times)

Alfista

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4MR357P help with info
« on: April 01, 2017, 05:42:05 PM »
Hi everyone,

 I found this console at an estate sale recently. The owner's daughter said her mother bought it new, and it's been right there for 60 years. My wife loved it, so I jumped at the rare, wife-approved chance to by vintage audio equipment and here it is.
 But what, exactly, is it? I thought it would be a Stereo Theatre, but that name is nowhere to be seen.

Here's what I know:

Model# 4MR357P,  Finish 4AH,  Serial# 1952651
To my surprise, it's all tube!
Amp is stamped  1 44 2  on top of the chassis in ink
Sticker on front side of amp shows 9304-10
MFR/Date code on woofer is  465-239
MFR/Date code on mid/tw is  137-245
MPX decoder

24AHP CRT, I assume this is a 24"
No UHF option

Hmm, let's see if I can figure out how to add an image to a post... OK, hopefully that works.


Just so you don't have to ask - I paid $35.00 for it and the unit was turned on providing background music for the sale.

We also brought home a big 1969 Magnavox console TV with sliding doors.


-Tim

electra225

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Re: 4MR357P help with info
« Reply #1 on: April 01, 2017, 06:00:30 PM »
I've been trying to buy a Stereo Theater for almost two years.  I'm jealous.   ;D
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Alfista

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Re: 4MR357P help with info
« Reply #2 on: April 01, 2017, 06:44:06 PM »
I see that I posted my first post to the wrong group.  :-[

Electra225: Yeah, sorry about that! I'd send it to you if my wife didn't like it so much!
 I read your thread before I was able to pick this unit up. I was trying to decipher just which model this console is, and haven't made too much headway on that since its been sitting in front of me.

So this is a Stereo Theatre?
Most likely 1963 given the date codes and tube innards?

-Tim

electra225

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Re: 4MR357P help with info
« Reply #3 on: April 01, 2017, 07:01:59 PM »
Yep, it is a "five-knobber", the smaller version of the Stereo Theater.  The smaller models were built with 21", 23" and 24" CRT's while the "big", "six-knobbers" had 24" & 27" CRT's.  Remote control was an option on both versions.  Yours is most likely a 1961 model, according to the knobs.  The 1963 version would have had a solid state record player and tuner with a tube black and white TV.  Codes on the tubes would confirm the year of manufacture, approximately.  Dating a Magnavox instrument exactly is risky business.  There were too many variations and exceptions, and it is not mandatory that dating be totally accurate.  Suffice it to say that you have a handsome instrument, well worthy of some tune-up and TLC that they all need after 60 years.  Multiplex adapters were technically optional equipment on most Stereo Theater models, but my research has revealed that many were so equipped.  I guess people figured they had shelled out used car money for a stereo, what was another $35 or so for the MPX.  Good luck with yours and post lots of pictures.  We can talk you thru whatever is needed to get it up and going for another 60 years.   ;D


I don't believe I have seen a Stereo Theater exactly like yours.  Many five-knobbers do not have provisions for MPX.  Yours does.  Yours does not have "FM-AFC" which a 1962 model would have.  Yours is an early 1961, based on that.  Interesting.  It has the S-600 series changer, typical, again, of 1961-'62 models.  I'd have to say, based on this, that you have an "up-line" five knobber.  It also has the fantastic 9300 series amplifier, the best amplifier Magnavox ever built, to my way of thinking.  Many of the five knobbers had the 8800 series amp.  Not necessarily bad, but not as desirable as the 9300.  Yours also has horns, typical of the Stereo Theaters with doors that slide over the TV.  That is quite the rig.  I'm impressed!  And jealous!


There was a series of six-knobbers built in the smaller cabinets.  I call them the "380" series.  They have 24" CRT's.  Yours appears to be a half notch below the "380" series, if that makes any sense.
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Alfista

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Re: 4MR357P help with info
« Reply #4 on: April 02, 2017, 11:32:44 AM »
  Yours is most likely a 1961 model, according to the knobs. 

 Yours does not have "FM-AFC" which a 1962 model would have.  Yours is an early 1961, based on that.   Yours also has horns, typical of the Stereo Theaters with doors that slide over the TV.

There was a series of six-knobbers built in the smaller cabinets.  I call them the "380" series.  They have 24" CRT's.  Yours appears to be a half notch below the "380" series, if that makes any sense.

 I appreciate your input and expertise! It's pretty obvious that there is no pinpointing the origins of these consoles. I was mostly concerned over what model to call it, or to look for in advertisements/brochures. I'm fortunate to know its provenance right down to the address to which it was delivered and the room where it made it's home until now.

 Unfortunately, I don't have the horns. I assumed the same thing before I opened it up. It's a six speaker model with an oval (4x8 or so) and round 4-5" driver firing through the narrow slots on the front. Cabinet width is 58."

 All speaker date codes are '62, so unless all speakers were replaced, it couldn't have actually been assembled in 1961...

 So I will assume that either it was ordered to customer spec (small town, it is likely that the dealer didn't have one on the floor), or Magnavox had a good stock of tube sub-assemblies that it needed to move out to make room for the SS stuff and they cobbled together whatever they could as the transition was being made. Either way, a ballpark estimate is enough to make me happy 8)

 We have a cat and small grandchildren, so I'm seriously thinking of removing the original speaker baffles and storing them so the original (mint) grillcoth doesn't get damaged. I do have a pair of horns that would fit the front openings perfectly, with a dispersion pattern that would be very favorable for that postion, so I may do a bit of experimenting once the tuner and amp are working well. I'm also toying with the idea of making a lock mechanism for the sliding top drawers to keep little fingers off the tonearm and knobs...
 
 -Tim

 


electra225

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Re: 4MR357P help with info
« Reply #5 on: April 02, 2017, 02:29:39 PM »
Okay, then.  Yours is a whole notch below a '"380" series if it has cone speakers.  By rights, it should also have the 8800 amp.  So you have an example of the mix and match that Magnavox used to build their instruments.  If the speakers are coded 1962 then the knobs are technically wrong for 1962.  Possible that they were holdovers from 1961.  Possible that a knob could have been lost and they were all replaced with these.  I have found an six knob Stereo Theater in New Jersey that is also alleged to be a 1961.  Yet it has the "sideways" tuner and a Conquest changer, both features of 1960.  This particular Stereo Theater model is not supposed to have been available in 1960, so there you go.  I did say that dating a Magnavox instrument positively is risky business.  I personally prefer to date an instrument by date codes on tubes and the changer.  I'm not a fan of speaker date codes.  In my estimation, the lack of "FM-AFC" would make yours an early 1961.  AFC was standard equipment on the higher-end Magnavox tuners in mid-1961 after FM stereo was made the law of the land.  It really does not make any critical difference, just food for conversation.  You have a handsome instrument, regardless of when it was built.  We know it was built by Magnavox, so that puts it on the top of the heap as far as audio reproduction in its day is concerned.


To further complicate matters, I have recently learned that the "five knob" tuners used in stereos and the "five knob" tuners used in Stereo Theaters are different.  The ones used in Stereo Theater are actually a five knob version of the six knob tuners.  They are referred to as "Series 100" tuners and the six knob ones are "Series 200".  These are also different from the six knob tuners used in stereos.  I have not seen either series of Stereo Theater tuner up close and personal, only in pictures.  About the only difference I see, outside of cosmetics, is that the six knob version has a dedicated power switch, where the five knob version uses the treble control (typically, not always!) for power.


A suggestion I would make to discourage cats from messing with grille cloth.  Take the lid off a pickle jar, or a small container of some kind and put some moth ball crystals in it.  Place the container with moth crystals inside the cabinet, behind the speakers.  You likely will not notice the smell, but the cat will, and they will not like it.  They will be discouraged from scratching the speakers.  It works for our cats.  Of course, you could always get a "400 series" Stereo Theater or a Concert Grand stereo that have metal mesh covering the speaker cloth!   ;)
If it ain't broke, call me.  I can break it....

Alfista

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Re: 4MR357P help with info
« Reply #6 on: April 05, 2017, 08:40:17 PM »
 Thanks for the mothball tip, I'll certainly give it a try. I have a pair of ADS L880's with perforated metal grills. I wish I could build a set of those for all my speakers!

 Hopefully, I can get started on it soon. My plan is to replace crossover caps first and power them externally to see how the speakers are holding up. I'll get into the amp and turntable after that. No plans to revive the TV at this point, as the stereo is priority.

-Tim

Alfista

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Re: 4MR357P help with info
« Reply #7 on: April 05, 2017, 09:18:56 PM »
 I've looked all over for an Auxiliary input. What does Aux refer to on the input switch?

bluetantra

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Re: 4MR357P help with info
« Reply #8 on: April 05, 2017, 10:38:37 PM »
Aux inputs are on the AM/FM tuner chassis.  Follow the green and black wires from the record changer.  You'll probably need a flashlight.
Music:  the other non-addictive, mood altering non-substance.  Ask your doctor if Music is right for you! Common side effects include but are not limited to uncontrolled head-bobbing, toe-tapping, finger snapping, selective hearing impairment, and persistent melody flashbacks.

Alfista

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Re: 4MR357P help with info
« Reply #9 on: April 06, 2017, 07:00:11 PM »
Cool, thanks!

Alfista

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Re: 4MR357P help with info
« Reply #10 on: May 02, 2017, 01:20:10 PM »
Can anyone tell me what size bulbs Magnavox used for these Stereo Theaters?


-Tim

electra225

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Re: 4MR357P help with info
« Reply #11 on: May 02, 2017, 08:59:15 PM »
I assume you are referring to the dial lamp bulbs rather than tubes, right?  Since I am not privy to owning a Stereo Theater yet (hint, hint!) all I can add is that my Magnavox stereos all use #44 bulbs for the pilot light (the red light under the Magnavox script) and the same for the dial lights in the tuner.  The bulb in the tuning meter should be the same.

This information should be included in the schematic and service information for your instrument.
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Alfista

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Re: 4MR357P help with info
« Reply #12 on: May 03, 2017, 02:31:27 PM »
Since I am not privy to owning a Stereo Theater yet (hint, hint!)

LOL, I think everyone on the site is trying to help you with that! If I find another one down here, maybe I can buy it, break it down and send it to you in pieces :D

Yes- I'm looking for the lamp bulbs, all of them appear to be the same from a distance. I appreciate your response, I didn't see that information in the service info. I saw what looked like lamp symbols, but nothing to identify the lamp size or voltage.

Thanks again for your input!

-Tim

electra225

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Re: 4MR357P help with info
« Reply #13 on: May 03, 2017, 06:55:56 PM »
A Stereo Theater will come along in due course.  I appreciate everybody keeping their eyes open for one.

Look on the schematic for the tuner and for the amplifier.  The pilot light bulb (the little red light by the Magnavox script) is powered up by the amplifier, so the bulb would be listed on the amp schematic.  The dial light bulbs and the tuning meter bulb would be in the tuner, so should be in the tuner schematic.  There is a list of parts with the schematic.  The bulbs are listed there.  #44's should put you in business.  You can also use #47 if you have those.  They draw a little less current is the chief difference.  They might not be quite as bright as the #44's in some cases.  Good luck.
If it ain't broke, call me.  I can break it....